A Pagan Gives Thanks for Christmas.

Since we are doing open threads, I figure it is safe to come in with something personal. Those who know me, know that I am not a Christian of any of the varied flavors. That does not mean that I have any animus towards Christians, by any means. I am instead grateful. My personal lack of faith does in no way invalidate, or even impact the faith of others. It speaks more to my failings than to anything else.

I mentioned gratitude. It is well that I should. Look at the various systems of thought that people try to use to guide their lives. Islam, the very word means absolute submission. And the goal all their existence is to be a worthy slave of Allah. Buddhism and Hinduism are focused not on life, but on release from the cycle of birth and death. Taoism is tuned to arcane mysticism. And Confucianism is less a religion than a way to get a lot of people crowded together in a small space to live together without killing each other. All of the varied forms of coercive Collectivism; be they Marxist, Fascist, or modern Democrat are based on the subordination of the individual to the Collective, and a belief that a human being can be perfected by forced submission to the will of specially self-selected, yet still themselves imperfect humans.

The only widespread faith that gives the individual standing, even before G-d, is the Judeo-Christian ethos. From the Covenant with Abraham, to the death and Resurrection of Jesus, it is the standing and free will of the individual soul before even G-d himself that is the source in our culture of the belief in the worth of the individual over the that of the State, over the will of Tyrants. It is that belief that makes us free men and women.

So, on this eve of the celebration of the birth of Jesus of Nazareth; I pray that you let this humble soul, pagan according to your belief, offer thanks for the freedom that comes from your faith, and a wish that you and yours are gathered in joy, health, and safety this Christmas. And that through the trials to come and after, we will continue to be able to so gather.

LC Subotai Bahadur, Lord Pao An


  1. 51
    LC SleepTech:Resident Rac(ial)(ist?) Mutt says:

    I cannot figure out why all y’all insist upon continuing to argue with a ‘Librul’.

    They can’t comprehend anything outside their programmed talking points. That is why they are thralls, ermm.. uh, I mean ‘Libruls’.

    And, I thought that the ‘N’ word was verbotten here now Deej!!!

    Because if it isn’t, all y’all know that I can wield ‘that’ mother fuckin’ word like NO OTHER!!!

    Stop using the ‘N’ word Deej, or I’ll start slingin’ it again. With NO apologies.

    I agreed to stop using it, but if it is going to become acceptable for a ‘Librul’ to use it, then why shouldn’t I???

    Another thing. I haven’t read every word of every posting, but I also haven’t read fortyleven posts of OUTRAGE over DEEJAY using the ‘N’ word.

    Is it O fucking K for a ‘Librul’ to use that word???!!!

  2. 52
    americanexpat says:

    Let’s see…Saudis bitch and whine and piss and moan about “Islamophobia” regarding complaints over the construction of a large, Wahhabi-funded mosque and Islamic center in a Virginia suburb, but refuse utterly to permit other religions to practice openly in the Kingdom. Nope, no hypocrisy here. Or British Muslims resist assimilation, demonstrate against British soldiers returning from Afghanistan, preach anti-Western hatred and jihad at their mosques, and urge adoption of Sharia within Britain, but also lecture the British government and people on the dangers of “Islamophobia”. What double standards? Nothing to see here. Move along, move along.

    One of the ways extremist Muslims advance their aims is by perverting the language, just as the Communists did. To be helpful, I’ve included a short glossary of common terms used by Muslims, and what these euphemisms really mean.

    Study Islam = intensive indoctrination into the program of violent jihad, followed by learning how to make car bombs, practicing marksmanship, and learning how to behead infidels
    Racial profiling = when a Muslim is arrested before he can carry out a terrorist act
    Proselytizing = threatening non-Muslims with death if they don’t convert to Islam
    Islamophobia = resisting the introduction of Sharia, Muslim immigration, or establishment of Muslim institutions in the neighborhood
    Apostate = any Muslim official who acts against extremists (i.e., Afghan National Army, Sons of Iraq, etc.)
    Hypocrite = see Apostate; also a general term for Shia Muslims when used by extremist Sunnis

    There are other terms as well, but that’s a start.

  3. 53
    LC SleepTech:Resident Rac(ial)(ist?) Mutt says:

    As a side note. I reluctantly wish others a ‘Merry Christmas’.
    I find it unsettling to use a ‘Chrsitianized’ Pagan holiday to celebrate my Lord’s birth.
    That goes for several other ‘holidays’ too. If you think about it, why would God cause special events to happen on days that had been celebrated for centuries prior for OTHER things by PAGANS!

  4. 54
    LC Thresher says:

    @ LC SleepTech:Resident Rac(ial)(ist?) Mutt:

    Well, we either continue to argue with them or we start shooting them.

  5. 55
    LC SleepTech:Resident Rac(ial)(ist?) Mutt says:

    LC Thresher sez:

    @ LC SleepTech:Resident Rac(ial)(ist?) Mutt:
    Well, we either continue to argue with them or we start shooting them.

    So, should I use “HP” or “FMJ”, +P+ or not? :em96: :em93:

  6. 56
    LC SleepTech:Resident Rac(ial)(ist?) Mutt says:

    LC Subotai, I do not mean any disrespect to you with my use of ‘Pagan’.

    After all. This is America. ALL religions are welcome. Cults; however, such as Pislam, well, not so much…

  7. 57
    lc purple raider says:

    Like I said, the only way that is going to happen is for you to root for the House Communists to demand the inclusion of a public option, then let Lieberman oppose it.

    1: Fixed that for you.

    2: You voted for these bastiges, you live with the results.

  8. 58
    Grammar Czar says:

    Since Jesus and Mo are being mocked in the cartoon, I suppose it’s no coincidence that there’s a phallus (supposed to be the beer tap, perhaps) featured prominently in the cartoon?

  9. 59
    LC Fei Long says:

    http://badwebcomics.wikidot.com/ <- jesus and mo has no entry here. that needs to be fixed.

  10. 60
    useless says:

    I could not pass this up…. I’m a pagan too. Also, US Army officer, and completely not a tree hugger, PETA moran or liberal of any type. I hate bible thumping Christians, mainly because I feel it’s a religion that is about 90% made up of other religions. It is, in my opinion a repackage of older pagan belief (yes, we came up with a one god-ism first), and I detest most churches that come at you with a hand out and a judgment of your character already on file before they even have their facts straight.

    HOWEVER….. this is a Christian country. Were it not for personal belief in Christianity (I give no credit to any church, there is no historical documentation to prove that), this country could be Mexico. Christian belief and the individuals relationship to god is what allowed this country to become something that no other nation has ever been able to achieve on this planet ever. So, yes, I am thankful for Christians and their belief, since it is what made this country great. All I ask is that you don’t ever believe a damn thing some preacher tells you (Christ was not born on Dec 24th, probably some time in the spring after first planting) you should believe in and instead do a little research. The bible isn’t foolproof, and no religion is perfect. In other words, if you should find yourself in agreement with the methods of the Taliban, you are probably doing it wrong!

    Well, anyway, happy day-you-choose-to-recognize-as-your-gods-birth-that-you-borrowed-from-someone-else, it’s a good a day as any.

  11. 61
    Grammar Czar says:

    It is obvious where YOUR mind is at. Do you often see penises drawn everywhere? Does that mouse you are using feel like you are cupping someone’s ball sack? Sheese.

    Yeah, yeah, I am being vulgar. But I am not the one who sees phalluses everywhere.

    Here, let me finish scanning your computer for more porn…

    Well, Mr. Smug-know-it-all…tell me, where ELSE have I seen them? Hmmm???? You have ZERO idea where I go on the net, what I do in real life, or anything else about me.

    Interesting that you should single ME out when this whole site is full of people who obsess over parts of other people’s anatomies.

    Gotta wonder…just why did you take my comment so personally? Is it perhaps that you saw it as well, but were embarrassed to admit it?

  12. 62
    Grammar Czar says:

    Christ was not born on Dec 24th, probably some time in the spring after first planting

    I don’t know of a single Christian who believes this. Most of the ones I know believe he was born more around the time we celebrate Easter. Personally, I don’t think God cares what day we celebrate Christmas; technically, EVERY day should celebrate the birth of Christ. :em93:

  13. 63
    Cricket says:

    We are not Catholics, but we did take our children to Christmas Eve Midnight Mass. My observations herein are not a comparison of Us vs. Them or Points of Doctrine. We were welcomed, given the Peace after the Lord’s Prayer, and enjoyed the service very much. My thankfulness is that I had the freedom to go to their house of worship. I am grateful they were able to worship according to the dictates of their consciences, and that such freedom exists in this country.

    We can go and worship where, when, and what we want. As long as religion helps us in our quest to become better people, which should lead us to God, (differences here mine) without interfering in the inalienable rights to life, liberty and happiness, we will be a blessed nation. In my opinion, being free to make choices is what God wants us to do. We chose to follow, rather than be enslaved. That, I think, is the critical difference.

    Excellent post, LC Subotai.

  14. 64
    Cricket says:

    What is your understanding of the Abrahamic Covenant, and where do you find it in the OT? Just curious.

  15. 65
    Grammar Czar says:

    You get this treatment from me because I reflect it back to you. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn’t mean you have to be nasty in return. It only shows that you have no real rebut.

    Funny. I was just thinking the same thing about you. I am generally nice to people until they pee in my Cheerios. If you think I am nasty to you, then you did something to deserve it. But of course, you, like my ex, will refuse to believe that you are capable of pissing anyone off.

    And you don’t know what I think about, or when, or anything else about me. Don’t flatter yourself. You aren’t that smart.

    And don’t bother to reply to me anymore. I’m done wasting my time with you. If you don’t like what I have to say, don’t read my posts. Is that simple enough for you?

  16. 66
    Grammar Czar says:

    The fact you have an “ex” explains a lot. He must have disagreed with you.

    You son of a bitch. How dare you? And you say I’m nasty. i don’t believe that gays are born that way. Would you like ME to speculate on what YOU did to make your son gay? Do you really want to go that route?

    I will say this once more…LEAVE. ME. ALONE.

  17. 67
    Cyborg says:

    Thank you, Subotai. So many non-believers like to blame Christianity for all the world’s ills. You may well be the first self professed “pagan” I have come across to actually give the Judeo-Christian way of thought the credit for what it has produced. I don’t know what others have said here but here are a couple of my thoughts on the effect of that ethos on the world we live in.

    1. The belief in a universe of order. Islam’s deity is so omnipotent that He can do anything – even up to and including contradict himself, break a promise, and punish one man for doing something for which a rewarded another the day before. The God of Abraham and St. Paul is unable to do something contrary to His nature. He CANNOT lie or contradict Himself or break faith with humankind. The Psalmist said that “The heavens declare the glory of God”. What that means is that all creation makes the creator more apparent. It was recognition of God being a God of order that motivated the first scientists (who many of whom were monks) to seek out the fundamental order in the universe.

    2. Equality for women. Though it took a while to bring to fruition, the equality of men and women is taught in the bible. Husbands are told to care for their wives “as if” they were the weaker one but in no other faith are husbands given a direct order to love their wifes to the extent of being willing to lay down their lives for them.

    3. The end of slavery. Again it took a long while to come to fruition but Christian masters were ORDERED by Creator God to treat their slaves as brothers.

    If you doubt what I say, look at contemporary pagan and non-Christian cultures today.

  18. 68
    Cricket says:

    No one makes you push people’s buttons, either.

  19. 69

    Taking some big liberties talkin’ expersions concerning (for ANY freakin’ reason) family, past n’ present like that Deej.

    I’m gonna go turn the stereo up..

  20. 70
  21. 71

    Freudian,, divorces ain’t pretty no matter how amicable,,

  22. 72
    LC Mike in Chi says:

    Deej sez:

    You choose to get pissed, just as you choose any emotion you feel at the moment.

    Bwaahahahaha…What a Billy Jack thing to say.(psst… I dare ya’ to read the whole review.)
    I’m tellin’ you Deej, sometimes, you really crack me up! :em01: :em93:

  23. 73
    LC Gonzman says:

    Far as Christmas goes, my position is this: If you resent it, give back your presents, give back your bonus, and go to work on Christmas day on regular time (or refuse your holiday pay if work is closed) – or shut the fuck up, you fucking hypocrite.

    As far as other of “The Holidays” go – it’s not my place to wish you a “Happy Whatever” on your day. If you follow a religion I accept your wishes for a “Merry Myholiday” in the spirit offered.

    Fuck Kwanzaa. Martin Luther King Junior didn’t become the mouthpiece for integration to give black Americans the freedom to ghettoize themselves and live in a self-imposed apartheid. The irony of going to a college that at one time had a black dorm forced on them, to now having a black dorm is not lost on me.

    And if I was Satan Mekratrig plotting in Hell, I’d have never looked to Anton LaVey to found my church, but to Mohammed.

  24. 74
    anonymous hourly worker says:

    Got busy over the holidays and missed the flame war. Now I’ll just have to act like my mother and utter, “G*d damn you all. I can’t leave you alone for a single minute, even on Christmas!” under my breath.

  25. 75
    Skul says:

    Ya, I’m a few days short.
    Merry christmas.

  26. 76
    LC TerribleTroy, Imperial Centurion says:

    Im curious……exactly who is one vowing to, in a marriage ceremony?

    Could it be……………..SATAN!

    Chuch lady dancin………

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