What went wrong in Iraq?

I think this sentiment has been said before, but I’ll put my take on it.

Until and not before the west actively engages with overwhelming force against the Jihadists  - A lot of the ME is going to burn. The whole hearts and minds mantra is worthless and totally counter productive over here. It was in Viet-Nam and is here. Iraq is just another mass conflagration of an mis-guided and wrong headed policy that the Obama administration has brought to the table.

Israel’s actions in the Gaza strip and West Bank are prime examples, every three to five years or so the situation “flares up into violence”.
Well Duh! Of course it did – you left your enemies alive at the behest of a bunch of peal clutching talking heads like John Fucking Kerry and Jen Pataki – what do you expect is going to happen? A simultaneous outbreak of Jihadist reflection, contemplation, and a sudden epiphany that translates to a willingness to step into the 21st Century?  Because you say so ? Pah-Lease. :em04:

And it’s that Same ol’ Same in Iraq. There might have been a small glimmer of hope in Iraq a few years back- Progress was slow but it was being made. Now? Forget it – it would take an entirely new war, untold blood shed, and a bottomless pit of money we don’t have to even attempt to bring IS to heel up there. Iraq is in my opinion – more than 75% likely to fall and become the next Hard line Islamic Theocracy in the ME. It will be interesting to see Iran’s reaction this no doubt as the factions in Iraq are Sunni and the Shia control Iran. But I digress.

I know, I know…..Monday morning quarterbacking is easy, but from where I sit, I have a better than average view of the goings on over here and this is my own personal take on things.

Obama does in fact own this. Why? Because, one after seeing first hand what his administration is doing, it’s very clear that they do NOT understand the Middle East and two… It’s a simple cause and effect situation.

Bear with me here, because this below point is critical to my argument.

The typical Arab – Persian mindset understands a central concept very clearly. Strength and Force of Arms. It’s bred into them from birth. They respect it. Or do you know of any other culture with a scimitar being so prevalent in everything from their flags, their religion. and right down to the buildings they live in?

If we understand this then the killing in Iraq while abhorrent and “senseless” to us – actually makes complete and total sense. IS is using overwhelming force of arms to subdue their perceived enemies. Archaic – yes. Effective – you betcha’.

Trust me when I say this – There isn’t a political faction in the entire Arabian Gulf right now that isn’t nervously watching what is going on in Iraq, because IS is a force – one to be reckoned with, and the power brokers over here understand that sort of force competently and without ambiguity.

Having said that, I mentioned it being cause and effect and by that I mean this:

When Obama took office, a Status of Forces Agreement (SOFA) was not yet in place between US and Iraq governments. It was still under negotiation. Meaning that US Personnel had no protections against being tried in some kangaroo court in Baghdad for whatever they felt like. It was an easy kill, (most of us thought) because Al-Malaki wanted upwards of 10,000 US troops to remain in Iraq. That’s the “force” side of the equation.

That “Force” would have translated into ……IS would have certainly thought twice before entering Iraq faced with the specter of 10000 plus US troops armored and armed to the gills with drones and air support to boot. They know they can’t face or hope to win against that sort of overwhelming force. It would have served to stay their hand and keep them on the Syrian side of the border.

What went wrong ……Obama being beholden to his base – refused that amount of “force”. He countered with a ridiculously low number and Al-Malaki balked….thus, they never got the SOFA agreement in place. Now….Obama really had to “End the Iraq war” and end it completely, and he did.

Again, bear with me here, I saw this first hand, by late 2011 the US capabilities in Iraq were mostly gone. It started in mid 2010 and it accelerated through 2011. Where I was? We were given 30 days notice – shut it all down, box everything up and ship it out. And 30 days later we were gone. To say where I was – was a strategic objective would be an understatement, yet we pulled the plug all the same, handed the keys over to the Iraqi’s and more or less said – “see ya”.

Why did it happen like that?  Simply put, It was politically toxic to Obama to leave that many US Personnel in Iraq. His base would have crucified him. So, He and the administration pulled out everyone and everything he could and left a huge vacuum – power (or force in this situation) as they say abhors a vacuum and here we are 6 years later with IS running amok in Iraq. But he got to claim he “Ended the Iraq war”. And the sheeple rejoiced!

Those of us with a lot of history over here sort of sit back and shake our heads now, because, in theory…. this whole “Caliphate in Iraq” mess was more than likely – totally avoidable, had Obama and his administration had the foresight to deal with the Iraqi’s in a prudent manner and not politicized this SOFA issue.

As much as I despise John McVain – he had the right of it when he said the US would be in Iraq for the next 100 years. I think that one stance probably helped to cost him the election more so than anything else he might have said, but in the end….he was right. It was the only way to try to ensure a stable Iraq. Overwhelming force on the ground to keep the warring factions in line.

So yes Virginia – Obama Built that. Or perhaps more accurately…Didn’t build what was needed to avoid what is currently happening in Iraq  due to misguided political posturing in affairs he was never equipped in the first place to deal with. And that boys and girls, is what happens when you elect a local community agitator to head the most powerful office in the land and prosecute a hot war.

16 comments

  1. 1

    CiS,

    that’s about as clean and as honest an assessment of what that whole mess is all about that I have ever read. It left me shaking my head.
    I am so tired of hearing the leftist apologists saying “we shouldn’t get involllllllllved, because it isn’t happening heeeeeeere”. well, neither did the concentration camps….unless you were Japanese and the democrat racist in the White House locked you up there……but that’s another story.

    I am so sorry that yours and all of our heroes (living and dead) efforts have been in vain………it could have worked.

  2. 2

    Jaybear, Colonel of Imperial Ancient Artillery says:

    CiS,

    that’s about as clean and as honest an assessment of what that whole mess is all about that I have ever read. It left me shaking my head.
    I am so tired of hearing the leftist apologists saying “we shouldn’t get involllllllllved, because it isn’t happening heeeeeeere”. well, neither did the concentration camps….unless you were Japanese and the democrat racist in the White House locked you up there……but that’s another story.

    I am so sorry that yours and all of our heroes (living and dead) efforts have been in vain………it could have worked.

    Nothing to apologize for or be sorry for Jay, after all it wasn’t you or the millions of like minded Americans like you that forced this issue. Myself and others involved in the “Long War” know full well where the fault lies and…. who should be apologizing for it.
    We won’t hold our breath waiting.
    LC IB CiSSnarl5.7 Imperial Foreign War Correspondent recently posted..What went wrong in Iraq?My Profile

  3. 3
    KArnold growls and barks:

    IS is using overwhelming force of arms to subdue their perceived enemies. Archaic – yes. Effective – you betcha’.

    That’s how Mohammed advanced Islam is the first place, all those centuries ago: conquest and the sword. It may sound a little Johnnie-one-note, but that’s how Islam has always advanced.

    The whole hearts and minds mantra is worthless and totally counter productive over here.

    Unless applied using the formula “two in the heart, one in the mind,” which I’ve always found pretty reliable.

  4. 4

    KArnold says:

    That’s how Mohammed advanced Islam is the first place, all those centuries ago: conquest and the sword. It may sound a little Johnnie-one-note, but that’s how Islam has always advanced.

    we need a modern day Charles Martel

  5. 5
    LC Xystus growls and barks:

    That’s how Mohammed advanced Islam is the first place, all those centuries ago: conquest and the sword. It may sound a little Johnnie-one-note, but that’s how Islam has always advanced.

    Actually trade brought Islam to the old East Indies & China.

    As for why Obst bailed out of Iraq so fast, there’s at least one other common explanation, but it’s also dismissed as a cover story, so I won’t bother. Iraq’s fundamental weakness, however, long predates US involvement, when the UK (some say Winston Spencer himself) drew the post-Ottoman border so as to put large Shiite & Sunnite Arab areas in the same country, along with some of the Kurds–who, word is, were supposed to get their own independent nation after WW I.

    As for the current Buttslammin’ State–let them eat Iraniac Revulsionary Guards, since they won’t take the South without facing our little hotheaded Persian pals. It could turn into–dare I say it–a quagmire. :em05:

  6. 6
    watchyerlane growls and barks:

    The problem with Iraq was and always will be it isn’t a cohesive body of people with similar goals and objectives. Tribal loyalties trumping national loyalty almost beckon the idea of making Iraq smaller nations (Sunni, Shia, Kurd) and letting them decide their own fate.
    Yes, we did have a peace….a peace I might add that was achieved through one of my favorite sayings from my favorite President when Ronald Reagan desired “Peace Through Superior Firepower”.
    As long as this fragile nation is surrounded by nations infested by religious fanatics all worshipping a pedophile false god, there is gonna be trouble and I don’t see how sending 10,000 11B’s and their support will change this.
    Oh and yes, this is all on Baraq Hussein. His inability to obtain a security agreement guaranteed Iraq would fall apart. It’s on him but I know the only way he would care is if he had a tee time booked at Baghdad National Golf Club. Other than that, he could give a rats ass.

  7. 7
    Crustyrusty growls and barks:

    What went wrong…? Naive people assuming the muzzies could function under a democratic government after we left.
    Crustyrusty recently posted..Confiscation? Really?My Profile

  8. 8
    DJ Allyn, MPSE growls and barks:

    THE QUESTION: What went wrong in Iraq?

    THE ANSWER: We got involved in it and broke it.

    There really isn’t any other “answer”. It wasn’t like this wasn’t predicted before the folly started — but no, we were all “traitors” and “un-American” for pointing out the fucking obvious.

    How many times have I said here that the worst thing we could have done in Iraq was go in and remove Saddam Hussein? As evil and brutal as he was, he was the ONE thing keeping this bullshit in the region at bay.

    Subtract the fact that we chose to go into Iraq for a “regime change” (or which ever of the 142 differing reasons we were given) this thread would not exist.

    Iraq has always been made up of different and opposing factions. It took a brutal asshole like Saddam Hussein to put a damper on it. He pretty much kept the peace, but the burning white hot hatred was still there.

    A lot of people seem to think that one Muslim is like every other — they aren’t. From the death of Mohammed, there has been a war between two of the major factions, and even among those factions there are sub factions who are at odds for some reason or another.

    Now that Iraq is broken, maybe we should just turn it into a giant cage match. Evacuate those who don’t want to fight, and let all the others go in and fight until there is a victor still standing.

    Then shoot him.
    DJ Allyn, MPSE recently posted..Youth of the Nation ~ P. O. D.My Profile

  9. 9
    LC Gunsniper growls and barks:

    As evil and brutal as he was, he was the ONE thing keeping this bullshit in the region at bay.

    The Kurds, Kuwaitis and the Iranians would beg to differ. The living ones, anyway.

  10. 10

    LC Gunsniper says:

    The Kurds, Kuwaitis and the Iranians would beg to differ. The living ones, anyway.

    The marsh Arabs too, I’m pretty sure they didn’t have Saddam for President stickers on their vehicles.

  11. 11
    Retired Spook growls and barks:

    if we were smart (yeah, I know, somewhere in the hills of East Tennessee there’s a pig who can whistle, too) we’d give the Kurds everything short of tactical nukes, and tell them “If you can take it, you can have it.” And let Iran, Turkey, and what’s left of Iraq try to take it back.

    As it sits, the Peshmerga is the one-eyed man in the Kingdom of the Blind, as far as military effectiveness goes. The other option is to nuke it til it glows.

  12. 12
    LC R6 growls and barks:

    How many times have I said here that the worst thing we could have done in Iraq was go in and remove Saddam Hussein? As evil and brutal as he was, he was the ONE thing keeping this bullshit in the region at bay.

    This moronic statement is one of the many reasons why no one here (or probably anywhere with sober, sane people) takes you the least bit seriously.

    You’re like a 5 year old that stamps his feet and screams to have it your way, but the adults know your way is dangerous to you and those around you so they don’t let you play on a 16 lane interstate freeway (although in your case that may have been the smart move).

    You know nothing about foreign policy and scream loudly enough so that everyone knows it. Stick to your keyboards and studio lighting. You have no place in the real world.

  13. 13
    Emperor Misha I growls and barks:

    DJ Allyn, MPSE says:

    How many times have I said here that the worst thing we could have done in Iraq was go in and remove Saddam Hussein? As evil and brutal as he was, he was the ONE thing keeping this bullshit in the region at bay.

    Also, he kept the trains running on time! Don’t forget that one!
    Emperor Misha I recently posted..Meet Neuropa, Same as AltropaMy Profile

  14. 14
    LC PrimEviL growls and barks:

    Another dismal example of the failure that is American foreign and military policy. Intervention without firm objective,
    and dilettante pissing around under crippling ROEs, followed by politically motivated abandonment.

    Korea. Vietnam. Croatia. Somalia. Afghanistan. Iraq. Acerbated by failure aid Allies: Georgia. Israel. Ukraine.

    The indecisiveness and lack of will trumpet to a World that only understands the decisive and merciless exercise of Power
    that the ‘Paper Tiger’ has neither fangs no claws, and is an ineffectual weakling to be dismissed from consideration as
    any real threat in the long run.

    The only hope to stop the Caliphate from returning to enslave the World is to brutally apply our nuclear arsenal wherever
    the Islamic Gorgon shows it’s hideous head.

    And yes, I would kill a fly with a sledge-hammer, or burn down the house to kill a cockroach.
    LC PrimEviL recently posted..Support Your Local TerpMy Profile

  15. 15
    Mark growls and barks:

    LC XYSTUS

    Actually trade brought Islam to the old East Indies & China.

    Actually all the muslime invasion did was shut off the northern trade routes which existed for centuries. The southern trade routes had also existed long before Mohammed.

  16. 16
    Mark growls and barks:

    Actually trade brought Islam to the old East Indies & China.

    Dammit, what’s with the editing and delete functions? I guess I’m incompetent.

    Actually all the muslime invasion did was shut off the northern trade routes which existed for centuries. The southern ocean trade routes existed long before Mohammed.